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M.O.M.S (Mothers of Murdered Sons/Daughters)
It really was supposed to be so different...as time goes by hidden memories pop up, some so beautiful and some so horribly prophetic...this was our family.
I remember during a phone call with Chris totally relating to what he was saying about the way his father was acting towards him.
I remember thinking it was very familar and hoping he was mixing us up somehow. But I never wanted to be the kind of parent bad mouthing the other so I mostly listened and emphathised with him...that hurts I wish I had asked more questions sometimes.
That's part of what's happened to us all here, if there was something we could have done to make this not have happened haunts us. Me, I just have a larger inventory of what if's etc.
Well enough of me,I'm just having a self absorbed moment.
I hope you are waking up to a very good day in a very different kind of life and have some very beautiful moments filled with love.
I didn't have to bad mouth the biological father of my boys I just told them the truth. He was and still is a piece of ****. Not long ago he had the gall to tell one of my friends "I sure miss my boy" I had to laugh at that one how can you miss someone you didn't even know, someone you never did a thing for, someone who couldn't stand you. Jim would go out of his way to avoid his father the one time his father was going to do something to help him out it turned out all that happened was Jim completed his end of the deal then got the shaft from his father. I kept my mouth shut that time I didn't say "I told you so".
Well I feel better :) I never in my life wanted to hate anyone but he is one of the three people I truly do hate.
Big Jim's Mom
Well I was a little surprised by your response but I'm very glad you feel better. I'm sorry to bring up these feelings you have for him but to put him in the same thought as Chris's pathetic father when ALL he did was nothing isn't what where I was going at all. I mean he didn't kill him right?
I liked my life better when I could just think what an idiot he was but now I know the true hatred and rage that fed his evilness had hid with us all along.
It was all about keeping the peace...I truly hated him long ago. I just forgot...so now I will carry the guilt that goes along with love I continue to feel from my boy.
I don't think I really hated him before...I didn't like him but I didn't have hate in me then and I would always say he gave me my 2 greatest gifts so for that I was grateful. I hate him now...I fear him now more than ever...
Yeah I wish he were only a poor father still instead of his executioner...with every breath forever I wish he hadn't done that to my Chris...I wish it had been me and my boy was still here.
Anyway I'm sorry your Jim didn't win in the Dad dept. either.
No he didn't kill My Jim just acted as if Jimmy didn't exist at all, his first words when I told him I was pregnant with Jim were "get an abortion". I have hated him for years for the way he treated my boys. I finally got out of the abusive relationship when my oldest Shelby was 8 and Jimmy was 4 because he had started to abuse Shelby, no telling what would or could have happened if I hadn't gotten out. I was scared to death of him for what he had done to me for 8 years but when it came to my boys I couldn't let him do the same to them and I didn't want them growing up thinking this was a way to treat a woman. So at the ripe old age of 27 I set out on my own with two young boys.
Lois, I don't really know how you feel or how I would feel if Keara's father murdered her but I can try to imagine and it would be awful to say the least. Keara was murdered by someone she loved and trusted but he was her boyfriend not her Dad. Keara's Dad like Shirley's ex husband was abusive and I didn't stay in the relationship for very long. He disappeared from her life until she was 12 and then showed up making all kinds of promises to her. Then he disappeared again and that hurt her deeply. That may have had something to do with her choosing an abusive boyfriend because she had low self esteem. As I look back on her life and the events leading up to her murder I have a lot of what if's and if only's. The bottom line is that all of us here have lost our children to murder and it is so very painful and hard to get through the days. That's why I think it is important that we stick together and have empathy for one another.
I feel the same, I was not trying for the most screwed up father of the year award with my post. I do know that the way Jim's father treated him hurt him deeply, he told me no matter what it took he would not let Sandra grow up the way he did without a father that cared. That was when I knew for sure how much it hurt him. I do believe that the way he was treated by his father led to the anger that at times would boil up in him. Well that is all I am going to say on this subject for now.
Hugs to you all
I guess your really not listening...I didn't have to bad mouth Chris's father, his actions were enough...his abuse a bit more sneaky...
I'm just wishing I had done what ever it was that would have made this not happen. But I don't know what it would have been. We are talking 30 years.
In my life I try NOT to bad mouth people, my son always said I was too nice but I can't help but wish I could have heard or said something that would have stopped this from happening...that's all.
I'm not trying for the worst father of the year here either...but guess what? He wins!!! These other fathers you speak of are saints in comparison. Yes they were idiots,***hole sand p***ks...but RKR goes to the front...he shot my boy in a rage 8 times, treated his lifeless body with not one ounce of love or respect, has shown no remorse...he wins.
Great just great..
I guess sometimes we can only hear our own pain it's so loud...
I had to read and re read these past posts.As a viewer on here I think that Shirley heard you and was responding with the hurt her ex caused Jimmy.You can slowly kill someone's spirit day by day which can cause a lifetime of pain.I have said in a past post that you and others who have had to deal with the realization that their child was murdered at the hands of a loved one have it tougher because they were in their lives and did the unthinkable.I mean how could they know your child and do this to them? You're right it was his father for God's sake.But I feel you misinterpreted Shirley's response.Shirley has faithfully answered numerous posts on here with love,support and a glimpse into her own pain.I don't think YOU heard HER.You are also right that we can all become self absorbed in our own pain and memories from a post can bring back old haunts from the past.This board isn't meant to up the other on how bad things are in someone's life as is suggested but rather to encourage others that are having a bad day to see that pain comes in all forms.I in no way believe Shirley was minimizing your situation but rather letting you know that her loser of a huband
didn't physically kill her son but emotionally did.Now let's see the love and God Bless to all my favorite MOMS
Did I mention Chris was naked when they found him... I was talking about my son...I watched that man try to kill his spirit all his life. And my boy had a very hard life, alot of challenges for 27 yrs. And he stayed strong and kind and loving. He was not a fighter but was in many fights. i just never thought he could do this.
I am sorry both Jim and Chris and most of our angels here didn't have the fathers they deserved and didn't mean to minimalize that.
I'm sorry if I did...what can I say I'm very screwed up from all this but I'm not alone right
Yes we're all screwed up there's no denying that.We all walk the same road of pain but each wears their own shoes.At times your shoes will wear out and you'll need to get a new pair in order to continue to travel, at other times they hurt and you may change them to see if that will make a difference and at others you will walk barefoot because you need to feel the pain that it causes being without. Things that continue to cause stumbling blocks in our walk are replaced with thoughts of trying to figure out new ways of how to make things better.When one thing doesn't work we try another.
I know that I stumble alot for the right words to try to comfort someone.
I hate when I see a MOM on here trying to figure out what they could have or should have done,like they think somehow it's their fault that their child is dead.We all go through this and I think that is normal at least I hope so or I'm more messed up than I thought LOL,but we must get past the what ifs cause they can bury us and hinder our walk.
From what you post about Chris thank God he didn't inherit the mean spirit your ex had.I know you are very proud of that.Concentrate on all his beautiful qualities and try to change your shoes,I feel you are walking barefoot right now and I continue to worry about you as I do with all the MOMS.Love and God bless
Perfect. To assume to know my shoes..........a reprimand. no less..lol
Please forget I spoke
Chris I love you forever...mom
As I have stated in my previous post I don't always know the correct thing to say to a MOM in pain,obviously I did a lousy job again.Reprimand? Never! just a suggestion to ease your pain.If I seemed assuming in any way I do apologize.I tend to remember where I"ve been on my walk and what has helped me.I have had to change my shoes many times,but again while we know each others pain ours is individual.Love to all and God Bless
Wow, I don't know if I should post but I will anyway and hopefully I don't hurt anyone's feelings that's not my intentions. I've always been the nice person, my boys always told me I had too soft of a heart. And I do believe that in most cases. Lois I cannot fathom the thought of someone in my life murdering my child, that has to hurt deeply. To think that you might have changed things or did things differently to have avoided this please know this is not your fault. My oldest son always blames himself for Timmy's death, he believed at first they were after him, he lived with that for 14 months while locked up in jail. When he found out that Timmy was in the wrong place at the wrong time and they were after the other guy, it took such a burden off of him, but he still thinks that maybe if he wasn't friends with the other guy, or knew him, or befriended him in anyway Timmy would still be alive. I tell him all the time, this is not your fault, you cannot forsee the future, we cannot stop the evil that invades another's heart. There was no way you could have know that this man would do this to your son. I understand too what Shirley has said because my ex had nothing to do with my boys, nothing! He was never there for them, even after Timmy was killed you would think he would try and be a father of the two boys he has left, and he isn't. He is oblivious. Do I hate him, no, but I can't stand him and I'll never forgive him because he never knew Timmy and was never part of his life, but that is his loss he will have to live with that for the end of his days. He hurt my boys in so many ways and they have to live with that pain for the rest of their lives. It is sad when my oldest son crys to me that he has no dad, a man who does't love him, a man who could be there thru thick and thin and isn't. I'm in no way comparing what Chris' dad did, that is unspeakable but he will live with that and he will suffer for it for the rest of his days and I do believe what goes around comes around, he will suffer for what he has done to your son. Know that in your heart, he will never fully get away from the awful things he has done. We are all in this together, we are MOM's who have suffered the greatest of pain that no mother should ever have to live with, ever. We are here for each other, to be shoulders to cry on, to be comfort when there is none to be found, to know you are not alone no matter what the circumstances are that brought us here. I love each and every one of you and I keep you all in my heart and I wish to be able to take all our pain away if I could. But just know that I am glad that I have found this safe haven, to know I can say whatever I feel and never be judged by it. So please don't think anyone judges you or that your pain is any less than anyone elses. We need to stick together and be here for each other, if we can't then who do we have if we don't have each other?
((((( hugs )))))