My son, Kenny was murdered ,almost 4 years ago, in the town of Epping NH. A 47 yr. old women killed him on her farm...I never had the chance to tell my son, how much I love him and how very proud I am of him...I never got to bury him and say ,"my last final good-byes", for she poisoned my son, dismembered his body and burnt his remains in a fire pit...Everyday when I wake-up, I pray it was all, just a very bad dream, only to come to the realization, it wasn't just a dream ,"my son is gone forever. I will never, ever again have the chance to hold him in my arms, and tell him, everything, will be OK." My son, Kenny could've been saved, had the police did what they were taught to do, protect and serve....They saw he had been, physically abused and they heard him being verbally abused by this women. My life as I knew it, is gone forever. "He's gone forever and nothing in this world, will ever be the same"...

OMG. I am just so sorry. I hope the woman was charged and put away. I cannot even imagine having to deal with that along with the loss. Carolynn I don't even know what to say except I am just so very sorry you had to go through that.

Thank-you so very much,for your warm remarks...
Yes, the trial lasted 6 weeks and she was charged with 2 counts of murder...The young man before my son, she also killed!!! Her appeal was on the 13th of January, Supreme Court in Concord, NH..So much could of been done had anyone listened to me...To the police, I was just a frantic mother, going on about her son!!! No-One, but no-one would help me, not even his father...he didn't want to get his family involved!!! My son, IS HIS FAMILY... i have never hated, as much as I do know... I always use to laugh, now, there's nothing to laugh about...I just want to pull the sheets over my head and fade away..

Carolyn,
I just wanted to say how sorry we are for your loss. This site is one where you will find mothers who truly understand and can feel your pain. Many of us, including ourselves, never got the chance to say goodbye to our children...just the phone call. You even had your right to bury your child taken away. We all have many things in common besides the bond that our children lives were taken at the hands of another. I understand how you were failed as our beautiful 18 year old daughter--Lisa Maas-- was stabbed to death by a stranger who sent out red flags for a period of at least 10 years with many of those flags being threats to kill. His threats were ignored. Even now our oldest daughter HAD an abusive boyfriend and when she decided it was enough the State Police refused to press anything more than harassment against him despite the fact that he not only threatened to kill her but tried to strangle her. Harassment...a summary offense punishable by $100...I am sure that is some deterent and now we monitor her every move to make sure he doesn't return to get another $100 worth. They are truly pathetic excuses for human beings too lazy to do the job you so correctly stated...To Protect and Serve. How well we can relate to how you are treated when you try and make them do their job..my daughter was told If you are trying to get him thrown in jail or your mother is coercing you into this that isn't going to happen and you are only a victim if you want to be one. I never realized that any of us or our children signed up for the victim of the month club and checked the murder box. I am rambling which we all do her now and then but wanted to let you know you are not alone and when you feel like pulling the covers and fading come on the message board and reach out as we are always here for you. We have a chat room and even have a blog Journey of a Murdered Angels Mother which we encourage all Moms to post on so we may share our stories and our angels with others. Take care and know we are always here for you. Laura & AV

Thank-you and I too am so sorry for your loss...It's so heartbreaking when we, as parents try to protect our child and the authorities, turn their backs..I really do think they should all be taught, LISTEN and HEAR what the child's parents has to say, "for if anyone, they would know when the law should intervene".My son not only was giving, but he had a learning disability. He was socially inept... He thought everyone was to be believed and no-one would would ever hurt him intentionally...I called the police almost everyday...I even asked them to take me to her house, so I could get my son and they said, no, they couldn't do that...Have you ever heard such nonesense!! This women was EVIL and she set out to destroy me, figuring I would give up....for that's what she did to other parents in the past and they stopped...She even told my son, that I didn't realize who I was dealing with and she will kill me if I continued harrassing the police- to put a stop to her...My heartaches for my husband and son will never have the wife/mother they knew before the murder...I've changed and truly, I don't like who I've become...Nothing seems to faze me anymore..No-one can hurt me or destroy me like she did..and as for the police...they all should take a good look at themselves and ask, MY God, what have I done!!! We made an innocent boy, go to his grave, and we also, destroyed his family, forever!!! There should be laws that protect the victims and their family not the person, committing the crimes..I learned that the hard way, when it came for her trial. For 6 weeks I had to sit there and hear these horrific things she said about me, my son and what she did to him. I couldn't say or do anything,for I would be thrown out of court, yet she could yell, swear and stare at me, and nothing would be done, except, maybe, take a small break so SHE could REGAIN her composure!!! I promised my son, twon things, I would make sure she goes to prison for life and I would go after the police for their neglegence in helping him...Again, thank-you ever so much, for reaching out to me..you see, I have no-one to talk to who would understand or just listen ,when I do ramble on..I've lost my reason for being here...he needed me, and I couldn't help...He died a horrible, horrific death and I couldn't protect him or cradle him in my arms...For that, I will always hate myself....

Hi Carolyn,
We all know the guilt and hate that fills are hearts. My mind tells me that I did all I could and I couldn't protect Lisa always but my heart tells me otherwise..that I have failed her. I asked my counselor if that ever goes away and she just looked at me knowing that I already knew that answer as my counselor is also a mother of a murdered daughter. Now she counsels others so they can actually talk to someone who knows exactly what they are going through. In her daughters memory she is helping others with the new life they now have. We all know that life pales in comparison to the life we had before and how true that our spouses, mates, children, siblings, etc. have lost that person that they loved so much--their mother. I cannot change back to the person I was before we had Lisa's life taken away or ever repair my heart but I can vow to do something I know Lisa would want just as you have for Kenny. One of those things is that I will not give the murderer anymore than he has already taken by taking Lisa (and the parts of our hearts that left with her). What is left with us I will not give to him and part of Lisa is with me as well as the rest of my family and that is ours to keep. I refuse to give him anymore although it is a daily stuggle and sometimes hourly stuggle. We read Kenny's story and watched the interview you gave and our hearts ache for you as you must deal not only with the horrific loss of your son but the failure of those who our tax dollars pay to do their jobs so pathetically. Then the "Injustice System" which my counselors tells me Why do you think they call it the Criminal Justice System? Do you see your name in there anywhere? It is not a system for you but one that is based on 300 year old laws set in place to protect criminals which it is doing just perfectly today! Ironic that is the only thing they do manage to get right is how to protect those that take so many from our society that could have made a difference and leave us with the most evil foul creatures that do nothing but take our tax dollars. Here I go again....I just wanted to let you know we are always here for you and how sorry we are for the loss of Kenny and hope you are able to hold ALL those responsible for his horrific murder. Laura & AV

I am telling you we need to do a Cindy Sheehan and congregate across the street from some officials place and get the medias attention so we can tell them OUR story of how the justice system fails us and we just hear, "It's the best we have but it isn't perfect." Well it needs changed and it is not being done. No one listens to us. We are treated like we did something wrong. I just get so ****ed mad about the whole thing. None of us wanted this and they could at least listen to us instead of blow us off. THEY didn't know them at all so what makes them an expert on our children and on telling us what is true about them? As for your oldest daughter Laura. Maybe the police need reminded of the lady who tried to get help from her abusive husband and he stabbed her right in front of them. They are lazy and the good one are few and far between. They just want to write tickets and collect overtime and go home. They don't want to get justice because it takes too long. I hear, "It isn't like it is on TV" Well I say take a lesson from tv then. I'd rather have Lily Rush or the CSI teams on my case.

Carolynn
I don't have much to add to what Laura and Kim have said I agree fully with what they have said. I just want to tell you how very sorry I am for your loss. I say our justice system needs to practice preventive maintenance lock these losers up the first time for the rest of their lives that way they won't have the chance to do it again.
Jim's Mom
Shirley

Dear Carolyn
I am so very,very sorry for your loss and the way your precious son Kenny died at the hands of this monster.I am so glad that she was put away and want to offer my services if their is someone in particular that you are going after in the police department who neglected your pleas.Possibly a letter written on your behalf stating your concerns and how they were neglected.I like to think that angels carried Kenny away before he felt any pain. Try to get the picture out of your head of what this animal did. I beg you to picture that instead dear Carolyn.You sound like a battered woman,who continues to beat herself up.You tried to intervene, hold onto that.You were a good mother, try to hold onto that.You succeeded in your promise to Kenny to put her away,hold onto that.I wish I could wipe your tears away but know that I'm sending you big (((((((((((((((HUGS)))))))))))) as are all the MOMS here and try to hold onto that.Love and God Bless You

Thank-you, Laura & AV, Barb, Shirley, & Kaylins Mom
You have all touched my heart, which I needed so badly!!!As I mentioned, it's been almost 4 years and everything has been kept deep inside of me...I see a counselor, but I sit back and wonder, "does she get it"..She's been very good, but I guess, I need more!!Every night as I lay in bed, I play back in my head, his laughter, which I will NEVER hear again...I see his gorgeous smile and beautiful face and all at once, the flashback of how he looked at Wal-Mart...I see the pain in his eyes, gone, his beautiful smile and such a very scared look on his face...Knowing, knowing, she was going to murder him and there was nothing he could do, but just wait and hope, it would be over soon. Funny. I taught him that if ever he was lost or afraid, go to the police...I can't imagine what he must of been thinking when he saw the police and they just escorted them out of the store and she told my son, " not to say a Feking word to them" and these so called protectors of ours, said and did nothing, but offered to help her put him in her car.. I went as far a contacting the Senator of NH to have a new law drawn up, so our children, no matter what age, can be taken from the home of the abuser and brought to safety...NOTHING CAME OF IT!!! I was told, once the trial was over, I would be taken to Washington and speak on behalf of my son, and how the law, only protected his killer, and not him, or his family members. ...I was told, "there was nothing I could do because of his age and it didn't matter, whether or not he was learning disabled...To me, that was a bunch of bullsh__!!!Who or what, protects these innocent human beings...2 books were written about this EVIL Spawn of Satan and in the books, the police say to each other, how badly my son looked ,but they NEVER put that in their police report....Oh, I could go on about the errors by the police and my own lawyer, but at the end of the day, "whose going to listen and take notice of the injustice given to the victim or their family"!!!

I am so sorry for your loss and just the same I could not add more than what the other mom's said, just how sorry and sick of what happened to your son. My son was 15 y/o when he was shot execution style, that was 2 1/2 years ago. We are going to trial at the end of this year, also another young man was killed too.

My heart aches for you. I know you said it's been 4 years, but yet the pain is still there. I know that I don't think the pain will ever go away. I think my heart will never heal.

Do you have a website for your son? Maybe you can post it to us so we can light candles and stuff.

You have come to a great place. all us mom's here understand the pain you live in.

God Bless
Bette
timmys mom

Bette, How very sorry I am about the loss of your son...Any age is toooooo young, but your son was only 15 when he got murdered..how very sorry I am!!! ( A handsome young man, was your son)!! Do you know why he was shot execution style??? God, it hurts me, just to type it...I can bring myself back to 2 yrs, when Kenny was murdered and if it hurts you to talk about it, I quite understand!!!

I'm sure all the mothers agree, but it's still surreal!! I have to pinch myself to see if I'm still here, breathing, functioning...I realize, it will never, ever get any easier, I can't believe when people say that to me, especially since they haven't walked in my shoes ..A MURDER is so much harder to deal with than an illness..I understand that as a mother, no matter what it is, our child should never die before us!!!

Has anyone briefed you on the trial??? The can and cannots that you can do...You'ld be suprised what isn't allowed...I wish all all the best at the trial and my prayers are with you..From what was told to me, "most murder trials are the same, so to speak" so if you need any information, I can help you, my son's trial just ended not to long ago..

I have done a memorial site for my son, his name is Kenneth Countie...I'm still in the process of learning what to do, for I have no idea what's it all about...I'm not one for computers, Im just learning, so if you can give me any tips, I would welcome them!!

God Bless,
Carolynn
Kenny's mum

I ask myself, "why". "why him" "why me", hoping that I would find and answer...My God, it hurts, it hurts so much that I pray one day I'll wake-up only to find, it was A HORRIFIC BAD DREAM!!!

I know and understand that it never gets any easier, but I can't work around this feeling...each day, it get's harder and harder and my whole being is consumed with his murder...I see his face, hear his voice, pleading with me to help him and there was nothing that I could do..I tried, but so many barriers were put up...God, help me!!!

My son was shot because he was a "witness" a "lose end" a "casualty of war" that was said at his preliminary December of 2008. yes over a year ago. The guy he was with was my oldest son's friend he was 26, he did lawn mowing and Timmy was going to go with him the next day and they went out late to get snacke at the 7-11 right around the corner from me. They were after the other guy but they knew my son knew them. so they killed him. the pain is unreal.

No we haven't done any of that yet since the trial is still approx. 10 months away. but I know I will meet with them to go over what is to be expected.

I want justice for my son but then I know it won't help my heart, it's too shattered to fix.

What site are you using? I really like the last-memories.com site I also have one on the memory-of.com site but they seem to always get viruses. If you play around with it you'll get the hang. But I can help you anytime. Most of the moms here have memorial sites so you can get some good ideas and directions. Just let me know what you need and I'll try and help.

Laura/AV is the computer geek (LOL got ya Laura) and great at stuff like this!

Love and hugs,
Bette

Carolyn, First let me say how terribly sorry I am to hear about your son's murder. I can understand some of what u feel I think. My daughter Keara was murdered by her boyfriend on April 5, 2006. She was beaten, strangled and stabbed 9 times in the neck. To have these kind of visions in our heads feels like hell on earth. I pleaded and begged Keara to get out of the relationship. He had been violent before and I knew all the signs since I had been the director of a shelter for battered women and also had worked with the batterers for years. I feel so much guilt because I had helped to save many women and couldn't save my own daughter. I think I should have done more even though intellectually I know I did what I could as I imagine you did too. Keara was also a mother of two children so they lost their Mom. The pain feels unbearable and a lot of times I don't know how we get from day to day. I know having the support of other Moms that are going through this helps a lot. I hope you can join us in chat also. Love and Hugs. Darien, Keara's Mom

Carolyn,

I know this story well since I too live in NH. My son was killed in Berlin during the home invasion there in November. I am sure you must have seen that story as I have seen yours. I know this is not easy for you with it again on the front pages of every paper and online as well. She was a very evil person. Your son didn't deserve to die the way he did. Non of our children deserve the ultimate end. My son was no angel, he was an addict, and did not deserve to die. Know that my prayers are with you. You can contact me via email anytime and maybe we can meet over coffee.

Donna

Donna, how very sorry I am to hear about the loss of your son...Yes, she was truly an Evil person and I know that my son, must of realized it, when it was too late!!! Having the story about the murder and this vial women, kills me..The truth of the matter is the papers, people, those that written books, really don't know the whole truth, as I'm sure you must know, having to deal with the article about your son in the paper...I'm afraid that I never heard of the murder of you son. but nonetheless, let me extend my condolences to you...Growing up, we read about people being murdered and we just read, and flip through the pages of the paper with no regard, really, (happy it wasn't our child) and then the unforseen happens, and we sit back and wonder, why don't people understand, how come they don't see the pain and anguish in our faces, then I realize, why would they, it's not happening to them...It just a story, just a story!!! Where in NH do you live??? As you know, I'm from Massachusetts, not far from NH..That would be nice to sit and have coffee with you...Just let me know!!!

My warmest regards,

Carolynn

Darien,

I'm so sorry about the loss of your daughter!!

I'm sure even if you tried preventing your daughter from seeing him, she would of just blown it off and said, "you're just being a mother, I know better" Or as all kids say, "get over it".. I understand too how you feel and what your mind is going through..You ask, "how do I go foward, what is to become of me, this really hasn't happened, it's all a dream, just tell me it's a dream, and then, I can smile again"

You mentioned she left behind 2 children..do you see them?? My son, has a son, but from day one, she wanted nothing to do with my son and never let him see his son..Until he was murdered and then came forward and wanted to be part of the family, but I can't..They hurt my son terribly when he was alive and I just can't forgive...It's just not there anymore!!! I understand, this is his son, he didn't ask to be born and it has nothing to do with him, but......Love, Kenny's mum, Carolynn

Carolynn, In answer to your question about my grandchildren, yes I do get to see them. They were 11 and 7 when Keara was murdered. They live with Keara's ex husband who is the biological father. I don't get to see them as often as I would like though.
My other three children live out of state and so do my other 5 grandchildren. Do you have family close by?

Darien,
No, all my family has passed away, except one brother..He rather not talk to me...why...I can only imagine... I did everything myself when it came time for the trial of my son, Kenny..

Just a thought to be thrown out there: Do you ever think to yourself, "God why the hell have you done this to my child and myself" You see, not only to I have to contend with no having my child anymore, but those I considered my friends, would rather not talk to me or even worse, when they see me,, try to avoid me at all cost...could this be because, (A) they don't know what to say to me, or (B) they think, "****, if I do stop and talk to her, she's going to go on and on about the death of her child, and truthfully, I don't have the time to listen to that, I have my own problens!! Needless to say, " I'm far removed from people in general". I want to shake them and say, "I can talk -trust me, I learnt how to since I was a child and if you, should you decide to, enter me in a conversation on todays events and problems, you'll be amazed at my feedback,but you'll have to reach out to me because that's something I can't do anymore. When I sat and prayed to God that he'd watch over my son and take care of him, this is what I got in answer to my prayers, "Kenny, you being murdered, in one of the most horrific ways" My life as it is now ,is meaningless. Everytning that I was taught as a child, ceases to exist. People aren't your friends and God, well just who ,and what is he ,because He let my son die and me die ,also

Yes Carolynn I have thought the very same things. I was not really religious before Keara's murder and now I am definitely not. I just think if there is a God he is not paying attention to what is happening here on earth because every day more and more good people are being murdered. I think everyone is entitled to their own beliefs though but I for one find no solace in God or religion. I also have lost a lot of friends so I understand that too. This is a terribly isolating experience and that is why I am so glad we have each other. Love ya. Darien

Carolynn
I am not a religous person I wasn't before my son's murder and I haven't turned to God since his murder. I don't blame God for My Jim's murder the only person I place blame on is the POS that shot Jim and his mother who was with him and gave him the gun. Most of my friends were Jimmy's friends, but it seems the ones who weren't Jim's friend I never hear from anymore. Oh well as far as I am concerned then they weren't my friend in the first place so I don't miss them at all. I have my mom,4 sisters, nieces and nephews who all are so very good to me and miss Jim too.
Hugs Jim's Mom
Shirley

Carolynn, I am so very very sorry your son Kenny was murdered so viciously, there are no words other than those already said by my fellow MOMS. Here you will find understanding, support, help, and caring hearts who truly know and feel your pain as we are all walking this same road. I just wanted to say to you to please meet up with the MOM who posted about the two of you meeting for coffee, it makes a world of difference. Love to you.

To Diane, Darien, and Shirley...Thanks for hearing me out!!! I know I write on this site everyday and I'm sure there are those who would rather not hear me, especially, if they just lost a child recently, but I guess, this is how I vent all the anger that's inside of me... I thought I would of come down a peg, but, "nah" the more I think of how and why, the angrier I become!!!

Day after day, I sit back and wonder, "why do I feel this way, is it just me ,or do others feel this way also". Once I toss it around in my head for a bit, I realize that anyone who hasn't lost a child , blimey, no way would they ever feel this way. I become locked in my own world, fighting to get out, but there is no way out..A friend told me, "IT IS WHAT IT IS, AND THERE'S NOTHING YOU CAN DO ABOUT IT, SO MOVE ON WITH YOUR LIFE". The only reply I could utter out of my mouth was, "HE WAS AND ALWAYS WILL BE MY LIFE"

Carolynn
It's good that you write on the board every day it helps to get it out and especially to others who understand what you are going through. I really don't see this getting any easier and for those who say, it is what it is so get over it, I say screw them put on our shoes for just a day and see if you think after that you could ever get over it. I have come to the realization that anyone who hasn't walked in our shoes will never GET IT.
Love and Hugs
Jim's Mom

Carolynn. I was raised in church and had spent my life pretty much believing in God. I had been praying so hard for Kaylin before her death. As a matter of fact my prayers for her were always ended with asking God to not take her before she was ready to meet him. The day I heard she was missing I knew something was not right this time. It was different. I had people praying and I was praying. I felt peaceful over her and then WHAM. I was confused. I didn't know what to think. I turned to my faith, but I have reached a place where I question so much and I just don't know if there is a God. I want to believe there is. I think an evil and shameful coward took her life. He had a choice and he chose to be the coward he is. I know evil exists. It isn't even that she died that made me question, it is so much afterwards that did added to her death. I stopped going to church and I stopped praying. I don't know if I will go back or not. For now I consider myself agnostic because I just don't know either way. I think that was a hard place to find myself because I had never questioned my faith before. I miss Kaylin so much. I cannot understand why, she was so close to help and it seemed to be blocked. I don't understand why this cowardly boy didn't just help her. She would still be here if he hadn't been the coward he is deep in his soul. I tried to think how his family must feel, but seeing the way they act in court, I don't care how they feel anymore. They raised that selfish, cowardly beast and I just do not care about their feelings anymore. I have lost a lot of friends and family. I have one sister who is always there for me to talk to. I think the other one is getting tired and avoids my calls. I have had a friend who was close to Kaylin see me in the grocery store and turn around and walk the other way. I have unfriended a lot of family on fb because I am tired of pretending that I am fine all the time so they are not uncomfortable. I am in pain everyday and I try to wear my mask around them so the few times I take it off it would be nice for them to at least pretend they care. It has made me look to see who I can let go of in my life and who I need to keep. It hurts. I left a poem on the blog. A friend told me that people think we are broken now and it made me think so I put it in a poem. Yes, ladies you have to read my bad poetry. :) ;) I miss Kaylin so much and I am trying to figure out how to live this life with her missing from it and I don't know how. I will ALWAYS talk about her. I did when she was alive and I still will. IMO if people cannot deal with that then I don't want them in my life anymore anyway.

Kim,
The only thing wrong with your so called "bad poetry" is that it is true! And we are the ones broken or as Bette said when they killed Timmy the killed her entire family just as all of us are dying inside.

Carolyn you have so many thoughts, questions, experiences,etc that we all have in common. We are trying to write a book for awareness so those who still have their "happy family" and lives can at least try and understand what we are going through. We have a blog Journey of a Murdered Angels Mother and would like to invite you as well as all the moms to post some of your thoughts on their so we may get a diverse collection. All the murderers have books written about them and I see Kenny's killer is no different having at least two about the evil person that she is. That is what this world is becoming so much more and more. Greed and evil are overtaking it and the good people are being taken out of it at a faster and faster rate. I too question what I believe and my faith. The minister that spoke at Lisa's funeral told me the evil of this world took Lisa and this was not God's doing. But I too wonder why he didn't intervene but I do have to believe in one thing. That when Lisa's died that she did not die alone and was surrounded by angels to escort her to her next destination in the spiritual world. Because if I didn't have that to believe in then I would have nothing. Luv you all and hope we can see more moms on the blog...and write our own book instead of reading about all the evil coward b@#$@#ds in this world.
http://journeyofamurderedangelsmom.blogspot.com/
Once again the sign in is mylilwheezie@roadrunner.com and password missnrangels.

Kim/Kaylins Mom,
I just thank God my mother isn't alive today..She helped raise Kenny after my car accident, her & my father. She was such a devout Catholic, even when she had an operation on her spine, way back and the doctors cut in the wrong place, which left her left leg completely void of feeling, she continued to go to Mass. (walker, then crutches, cane, and after years of PT, she learned to walk unassisted) This would of killed her, put the seal in her coffin, so even though I miss her so much, I'm thankful she wasn't here to see this!!
I too felt like you when the police saw Kenny at Wal-Mart ,in a wheel chair, face all beat up,his right hand, swollen and burnt, at that point why didn't the they intervene...A friend of mine who is a priest told me, " Carolynn, God would never intervene, he gave people the freedom of choice and it wasn't He who did this, it was an Evil Entity in Sheila, and the cowardness of the Police...They, in time, will meet their fate and be punished". He told me to "be strong, stand firmly on my feet and continue to fight for Kenny". I sat there and listen to what was being said to me and argued my point of view about the horrific murder of my son. At the end, I said to my friend," Well, we can agree to disagree", smiled and shook his hand. My final question to him was, why father, do you believe..wouldn't it be horrific if you've given up your life for God and in the end, there is no God. I guess that's something you or I will never know...He looked at me with a impish grin and said, "Wouldn't it be heartbreaking for you, if in the end, you lost all hope and God was and is there and you locked the doors and closed him out" (something to think about)This is a remark that I've been wrestling with!!!
Father Jack has told me many things through the years to do and I've done them, only to realize, God didn't listen to me when I prayed to him, please don't take my son, he's only 24 take me, I have lived a long and good life, so why would he listen now!!!! "

I find that now I live in fear of losing my son. I keep it to myself or share it with Doug. I still let him go do things but inside I am so afraid. He is my reason for getting out of bed most days now. He is talking about when he will be driving and I used to look at that as a milestone but now I hear how many wrecks teens have and I get afraid. I know it is irrational and I am trying to get through it. I don't want to stop him from living his life because of my fear. Do any of you feel that fear over your other children? I don't think Jared even knows I feel that way. I just give him extra hugs and kisses and I love yous and he thinks I am just being MOM. When they took our children they DID take our lives. Bette is right. Everything is in a different perspective now. Before I was one of those who thought

Kaylins Mom,

Oh God, yes ,I still have the biggest fear when my son, Bryan goes off and he's 22....Selfishly, I make excuses as to why, he shouldn't go off...I'm so afraid I'm going to loose him from drinking or a car accident...I think he realizes what I'm doing and he doesn't say to much, he just smiles, gives me a kiss and says. "call me anytime or better yet, text me...lol I wish I could let go but the truth of the matter is, I do control his life...I'm not proud of it, as a matter or fact, it stuns me to even admit that, but....Life has changed, not for the better and as far as I'm concerned, it's not fair..I was and always have been a good mom..I watched over my 2 boys and made sure that knew what slang words meant if anyone said anything to them. Especially, Kenny, I always watched over him to make sure other kids weren't picking on him, which they were, when I wasn't there to protect him...I sent him to learn Kung Fu and Karate and because I was a boxer in my early years, I taught him how to box and stand up for himself...Bryan, he's alot like me...he's street smart, he listens and hears what people say and decides if they have good or bad intentions...Bryan, never got pick-on in school, he also did Karte and became an adult black belt..He was ALWAYS watching out for his older brother, which Kenny hated, because it should of been the other way around!!!

Just a thought, for those of you who have other children, have they changed in any way since the murder? (gotten closer, pushed away, or totally became introverted when they weren't?) My son Bryan once upon a time, was very lovable..He always wanted to be hugged or kissed, now I can't kiss or hug him, he just pushes away and talk, well, not to me. He'll talk to his father, enter in a conversation with him on just about anything, but when I try and talk to him, it's only a brief sentence or one or two words..I've lost that mother and son connection that I once had with him. If ever I do try and talk to him, he's immediately condescending, arrongant towards me. Playing the devils avdocate though. sometimes and only sometimes will he become the Bryan that I once knew before Kenny was murdered. I've lost who I am and what I am and Bryan lost a mother he once knew..."Such a horrible domino affect this has had on each and all of our lives."

Dear Kim,Laura/AV,Shirley,Bette and Carolyn

It breaks my heart that you are all wrestling with your faith due to the murders of our children.I cry everyday not because of a lack of faith or questioning God about why He allows horrible things to happen but rather because I miss my son.I remember a mother who lost her son visitng me when Nicky died and she said "How can you still pray?".My response was that most people would run away from God I needed to run to Him to pay attention to what I believed He was trying to teach me or tell me.I wouldn't even begin to put myself on the same level as God's thinking or actions because I don't know all things as He does.What I do know is that He has a Master Plan and I believe our children were all a part of it.About a month or two before Nicky died I was laying in bed before I had to go to work and he came down and layed next to me and we started talking about God.I told him that I could endure most anything except the death of one of my children.His response was " don't worry about me mom if something were to happen to me I would be with my Creator and isn't that what the ultimate goal is?" I looked at him and half heartedly said you're right Nicky that is what I taught you.The fact is that he was certain of this and I was not.And so I began reading the Bible after Nicky died and prayed for understanding and wisdom.Alot of doors opened up to me during this time.I don't doubt for a minute that Nicky is with His Savior happy,it is me and my family who are left grieving his loss.Nicky was the one ready when God called,so now I need to be ready when He calls me so I can join my son one day.If Nicky had not been taken then maybe I would have continued living my life as I had,half in the Word and half out,wishy washy.So maybe I would die someday and not have really known the Lord.I don't want to assume anything that God has planned but I gotta tell you maybe God's plan was that this would bring us all to our knees in prayer to Him so that I too can join Him someday. Some of us are ready quicker than others.Eternity is forever,this life we lead here is but a vapor.At this point I know I want to be with my Savior and son someday,that would not be possible if I turned my back on God or if I felt He had turned His back on me.Trust is the key word here.Have faith that there is someone bigger than yourselves who has worked this out and we will know one day why things happened the way that they did.I wonder everday what Nicky's children would have looked like or what he'd be doing today on earth,or what kind of man he would have become.I probably will till the day that I die.I will def be sad till the day I die that it wasn't me first.

Kim, it was you who gave me a picture in my head of legions of angels carrying my son away.I thank you for that.When I first came on the message board 1 1/2 years ago I was a mess missing my son and grieving.I believe that God sent you to me with that thought.

Laura/AV it was you who coined the phrase Missing R Angels.Tirelessly trying to teach me the computer over the phone.Making a special trip 6 hrs each way to bring me a computer compatible to yours setting me up so that I could light candles and do kimi's in honor of R angels.God sent you to me when I needed you most.I want to thank you for that

Shirley it was you who brightened my dark days with memories of my son,coffee mug, computer pad t shirt etc.Always letting me know he wasn't far from my heart.Encouraging messages emails kimi's etc.I want to thank you for that.I believe God sent you to me to encourage me.

Bette it was you who showed me that finding a dime was more than finding 10c.It is our angels letting us know they are close even though we can't see them.I found strength in your words on message board because you write from the heart.I want to thank you for that. Yes, I believe God sent you to me

Carolyn it was you who made me take a look at where I am today.Sad as I am for you,I will pray for you as I do all the other MOMS.I truly like the words your pastor gave you and they were a blessing to me as I read them.Thank you for sharing them.I thank God for sending you to me.

So you see,even in my darkest hours The Lord said He will not abandon me and the proof is in all of you ladies.

What have I learned from my son's death?

Tolerance as nothing will ever be as bad as my son's death

Patience For comfort and peace come when you least expect it.

Forgiving others Because that's what Nicky's motto was

A tender heart because He taught me to understand others pain

A listening ear because there are so many others in pain besides myself

True friendship because that is what you all have taught me.

Everyone has their own beliefs and I'm not trying to shove mine on anyone else.I just thought that maybe you all needed to know you make a difference in everyone's life whether you realize it or not.That is no mistake on God's end.He sends just the right message or person to help you through the day.

To all the other MOMS I haven't mentioned,I thank God for all of you too.Each and everyone of you has been a blessing in my life.For those of you who do pray please continue to do so for me as it is my strength to help me through this painful journey.Love and God Bless

Barb
I have gotten so many different answers that I just don't know what to believe anymore.
Like, God didn't take Jimmy and then I hear God called Jimmy home. Then Marlin was only the tool. Then, there is the, all good people go to heaven, but you have to take Jesus into your heart or you won't go to heaven. I am a good person I think I am anyway so why would God turn his back on me when I die just because I wasn't a religious person when I was alive? My Jim wasn't religious so when I am told God called Jim home I really get confused because of being told that if you don't accept Jesus you don't go to heaven.
When Jim was 17 months old and severely burned I preyed to God to not let him die then I had to watch the months of terrible pain he went through and all the surgeries. Even watching him go through all that I thanked God for not letting him die. Now I am left wondering did I just get a reprieve for 30 years? I am told God gave people freedom of choice I think if he gave it seems its time to take it away because so many people abuse that right.
I do believe I will be with My Jim when I die and I also wonder what he would be doing with his life if he were still here. I am thinkful that I have a piece of him in Miss Sandra but what a sad thing for a 7 year old that had just been reunited with her daddy to only have him taken away from her once again.
Sandra's take on all of this is that we all go back to being children when we die so when she goes to heaven she will be able to play with her daddy. Such a simple answer and who knows maybe she is right.
Love ya always and forever
Jim's Mom

In the beginning I turned to God. I had been raised that way all my life. To always turn to God. I was confused because I was praying so specifically for Kaylin. Ernest prayer every single day. I ended every prayer with "Please, don't take her before she is ready." It was a shock to me and I was confused. Even then I did not blame God, but knew there is evil in this world and the evil took her. I believed God protected her and made sure we found her. I was reading my Bible and praying everyday. I did all I knew I was supposed to do and it seemed like every prayer was not answered or was answered exactly the opposite of what I asked. That made me afraid to pray for justice because if the answer was the opposite of what I prayed then he would get off with nothing. I had one day when I was alone and told God how I felt. I let him know that I was doing the best I knew how and was trying and that I just needed to know he cared. Just to know he cared would help me to get through and know that he knew my pain and was still there. I got an unexpected bill that I had no idea how we would pay. I tried to be patient and to remember that God answers in his time. I have always been raised that God is a loving Father and that he is like the Footprints poem and that when you cannot go on he carries you. A series of events left me feeling like God had thrown me outside and kicked me when needed him most. I again asked God to just show me he cared. I asked for any sign he cared and got nothing. I looked and would have grasped anything because I wanted it so badly. There was no answer. I believed in Tough Love with my kids. Even at that I would be there to help them through and to tell them I was there to help them if they fell but I would not abandon them, especially when they were trying and crying out to be begging me to just tell them I cared. I found out that God was not who I thought he was. I used to go to church. I used to pray and read my Bible every day. Our preacher's wife emailed me. She is a sweet lady. She really is and she told me they would walk with me. I took a chance. I emailed her that I was struggling and that I was questioning my faith. I poured my heart out to her and I got "Let us know if we can walk with you at this time." back as a response. All I could think was that I had poured my heart out and it was ignored. To me it felt like another slap in the face. I have never in my life felt that God was not there and now I do. I would love to believe. I want to believe but how can I? How can I believe in a God that I am afraid to pray to because he may answer the opposite. I know he answers in his time and all that, but it seems that my prayers are not worthy of his time. I was on the floor crying and begging him to just show me he cared and he wouldn't even do that. I am glad when people can believe in God. Maybe he answers other people's prayers but he doesn't answer mine. I admire you Barb. I admire that you are able to keep your faith. It wasn't even that Kaylin was murdered that made me question, though I didn't understand that. It was a series of so many things afterwards. I just don't have the strength in me to keep begging God to hear me. I never believed in predestination before but now I wonder. This of course is just my personal opinion and I would never tell anyone one way or the other what to believe. I don't seem to be one of the people God cares about losing. I always heard that it is we who walk away from God because he is always there. I can honestly say I was doing everything I knew to do. I can honestly say I was trying and did not come to this decision over an unanswered prayer. It took me awhile to get to this place. I feel like God walked away from me and turned his back on me this time. All I needed was one tiny thing to tell me he cared and I could have hung on. Ok, finished with my vent. :) Love you Barb and I am glad you are you. {HUG}

Dear Shirley and Kim
I don't have the answers to so many questions that's for sure.Nicky happened to be verbal about his faith,alot of people aren't they keep it personal between them and God.The thief on the cross cursed God in the beginning and then seconds before he died turned to Jesus and asked him to remember him when he came into his kingdom.The Lord's response "Today you will be with Me in paradise".How forgiving is that? If I knew nothing about Nicky's beliefs that is what I would remember could have happened. I don't believe someone has to be religious to get to heaven.It's their heart that God looks at.It is one's actions with others that God sees.I never had the pleasure of meeting everyone's children,but I did have the pleasure of meeting all their MOMS through this message board and I gotta tell you I believe that saying that the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.So you see I can't help but have the views that I have concerning where our children are.Safe,sound,happy and in the arms of Jesus.I def don't believe that God keeps a score card,I do believe that we are all a work in progress.

Kim
You said you begged God not to take Kaylin until she was ready.How do you know she wasn't ready? Again the thief on the cross.So it isn't about where they are anymore but rather where are we? It is us who weren't ready for them to be taken.Maybe this message board and all the MOMS on here are the proof that God cares.

I remember saying to someone in church one day long ago how come I am praying and praying and nothing is happening. Am I not worthy of His prayers or time? I kinda got the same answer about He does things in His own timing,but I also got a response from a very wise woman who explained further and said no,He feels you ARE worthy and that is why He is trying to teach you.When we raise our children and they ask us for things most times it would be easier to just give in so we didn't have to hear them whine.But what does that teach them?. It is the better parent who doesn't give in but the child learns a lesson instead.At the time the child doesn't understand what lesson that would have been,but as they grow older they realize and say I remember my mom or dad trying to teach me that,and the understanding is there.Like I said we are all a work in progress.I had to endure with my children crying many times because they didn't get what they wanted when they wanted it.It hurt me,but I knew in the longrun they would be better people for it.I believe God raises us this way.Learning patience,tolerance,love for others etc.When I see the many things that you do for others Kim, I see Jesus in you.Can't help it girl,I just do.Love ya kiddo
P.S. I know you said you were looking for one tiny thing,well I'm no tiny thing.Last I weighed myself I was 190 lbs,but if you ever need me,I am here

Shirley
It is so very sad that Sandra was reunited with her daddy just for him to be taken away,but God love her for believing what she does that everyone reverts back to a child and therefore she will be able to play with him on her level.That brought a smile to my face amongst my tears.Out of the mouths of babes.I bet when she told you that you envisioned that scenario.I would have been smiling for weeks.LOL
You do have a good heart Shirley so what does that tell you? Jimmy had a big heart too.As far as people telling you that God took Jimmy home and then others telling you Marlin was the tool.We don't know who is responsible for Jimmy's being taken when he was.It doesn't matter to me who was responsible for that.It doesn't bring him back either way,but it can be a confusing thought.I remember being confused with Judas and his betrayal.I thought well poor Judas someone needed to be the tool to betraying Jesus,and that role fell on him.It was explained to me that it was Judas's heart that fell short.Peter also denied Christ but his heart was in the right place so he was forgiven.I am trying to explain to you how I feel that I see Jesus in all your actions,because you have the right heart Shirley Love ya always girl

It is not hard to answer other MOMS on here when it comes to court proceedings or how we miss our children or how this has devestated our lives.It is hard to try to express your views about God because not everyone does believe what I do.I do feel as though this message board is for all views though and I needed to express mine.Favorable or not.My intention was to show another MOMS view on how I am trying to cope,and how much you all mean to me.It was not intended for you to believe what I believe.Still gonna pray for all the MOMS out there.It is the only way I know to ease this pain.Love you guys always

Matthew 10:37
"He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me."

Hi Moms,

For what is it worth one of my supervisors told me that until I release Lisa back to God I will always have the pain in my heart. That until I put God first and not the loss of my child (or the notion that I must be more religious so someday I can again be reunited with Lisa) that then and only then will the pain be released. It is a very hard concept for me to follow especially seeing as this supervisor still has his family members but from things I have learned in the past I did understand what he was telling me. I at this point cannot do that and the pain is killing me as I know it is so many of us. Perhaps if there is someone out there that can relate to this or has been able to do this they could share with us.

Luv ya all....Laura

This is such a sad post. So many of us in so much pain. Asking questions that we know we will never get the right answer for. Trying to figure out why God would do this to us, why would evil enter our lives nd kill someone we love so much! I wish I knew the answers as I read each and everyone's post here I say the same exact thing to myself. Each one of you said the things I say all the time, and how each of us lose people we once cared about, how in the supermarket they turned away when they saw you! I've had that happen, I knew they saw me but pretended that they didn't so I just would pretned I didn't see them either. Or how friends that used to call me don't. How I lost a b/f of 10 years who is now LIVING WITH ANOTHER woman wiht a child, who I just found out about and I know **** well that this just dind't happen over night when we were emailing each other or he'd buy me perfume just past March and he lives with the person since may? when all these years I wanted to do that combine our family but not he couldn't handle the boys, but yet here he is with someone with a kid. Oh believe me I sit and wonder WTF did I do wrong all the time, and why am I being punished over and over again, tha I know I'm a good person or try and be the best person I could be so why do these things happen? Why did my son get killed he was a good kid, why are my boys suffering thru anguish now and probably will never have a good life and will live with this pain much longer than I wll have to and it saddens me to see them try and grip onto what little they have left to grip onto. As I sit and watch my life fall apart and be just filled with containt despair,anguish and sadness, and my boys have to live with me who can't help them anymore because I am completely drained of life, how they are falling apart in front of my eyes and I try an dhelp but only make things worse and how I can't understand why they do some of the things they do knowing how much pain I'm in and tyring to explain to my sons do you see what you are doing to yourselves? to me? but is this their fault? I can't answer that because I see myself in the mirror and I dont'even recognize ME anymore, there is a different person standing there. Is this what they are going thru too? fighting their own demons, seeing their mother falling apart each day, and that is why they do what they do? So many questions, so little answers. I never ever in my life thought that I'd ever go thru so much pain or sadness. I remember before seeing news about people getting killed and I would think how sad that is how terrible this family must be going thru, and then it happens to me and I sit and say OMG was I so blind?? Why oh why are there some people who go thru life and everything is good, they have good jobs, good cars, nice houses, kids in college, happy families. And me, huh??? is that selfish or what? yes I know it is but I wonder why I have been brought so much pain and sadness and feel like my life is nothing anymore and the only reason I go on is the believe that I will see Timmy and to be there for my boys but I really have not much left of me to give. I get up each morning thinking here we go another day of pain, another day to be sad. and wonder why me? why you? why do we as moms have suffer this pain? I always know that in my heart my mom's here are the only people who understand what I truly am going thru. You all have been my life support I don't know what I would ahve done without any of you in my life right now and maybe God did send me this way, I can hope that in my heart he knew I would need you all. Because I don't believe it was God that took Timmy away from me, I bleieve it was the evil in those two men who took life as nothing, who hated a man so much because of his color and decided to kill a young boy because he "just happened to be there' a "casualty of war" it makes me sick. I see all your stories and think how can this happen to these beautiful babies? our angels? I will never understand. I wonder when I will stop trying to figure it all out? I don't beliee I will ever stop trying, I have been one that always was able to "fix" things, make things right, help others, and now I'm sitting here and I'm "unfixable" I can't help my sons, mom is supposed to always be able to fix things, now mom can't do anything but cry.

Well enough of my rambling. I just had to post and say how sad it all is and i wish I could take all our sadness away. If I had one wish I'd wish for all our children to be back home with each of us moms. And happy filled lives.

I remember that the day after Kaylin died, and the shock of thinking God why when I asked you not to take her did you? I believed that too Barb. I believed that he gave her that moment and took her then. I believed that he had angels waiting around her to take her home and to guard her body from the wild animals until she was found. I did turn TO God after that even more. I spent those nights when everyone was asleep crying and in prayer. I turned deeper into making sure I read my Bible and prayed no matter how tired I was. I felt that the only way to survive was to let God carry me through. I have always believed that God sometimes delays answers to teach us something. My mom used to tell me that until you had been put through the fire sometimes. I know that sometimes the answer is No or Not yet. I agree with everything you said about how we want to teach our children. Kaylin thought I was a hard nose for that, but I wanted her to learn something. Even when it sometimes hurt to say No or No because you are doing something that is the reason i can't say yes, I was always there for her and if she had said "Mom can I have this (and it was something I had told her no for whatever reason ex we told her we would match her dollar for dollar on a car but not outright buy her one. She never would save so she never got a car), but even at that time if she would have said, "Mom, I just need to know you care and love me." I would have told her that yes I loved ehr with all my heart and that I was there, but that the answer was still No or Not Yet. To me ti almost felt like calling the Suicide Hotline and being put on hold. Believe me my life has never been the easy answer. I cannot think of a time I prayed and the answer was immediate. God is supposed to be there at your lowest times to help you. If he isn't then what is he good for? Then at church a man testified how he had prayed to God about some things that he was in desparate need of and he had an answer within a week. This was a big answer too and all I could think was, why not me? All I asked you for was a phone call from a friend, a card, an email that wasn't a bulk God loves you email and nothing. I can tell you that there is a very different feeling when you come to realize that even God isn't there. Even when I prayed at that time I would try very hard to ask myself are you praying for a want or a need? I believed God could give either but I wanted to make sure that I was praying for needs. I held on to Matthew 7:7,8. I would tell God, I am asking I am seeking and I am knocking and all I got was crickets chirping. I would go to the back of my Bible studying to try to find what I might be missing or doing wrong. I was reading pamphlets on things like, WHy God Why? Meet Me Where I am God. I honestly do not know what more I could have done. The vision of God as a loving Father changed for me to one of a man who would yell NO then laugh at the confusion. Who would say to others nearby, she is doing the best she knows how to do but watch me knock her down. So when my vision of him changed I couldn't go back to the other picture any more. It really did take awhile for me to get here. I didn't just decide not to believe. I didn't even say three unanswered prayers and I am done. I did reflect back and notice that it seemed in my lifetime that everything was hard. While God seemed to bless others I had to beg for an answer, then it made me ask was it really an answer at all or was it just long enough that things worked themselves out? I thought I had been a caring person and tried to help others. I am not perfect but I do try to be there and help and when I realize or think I ahve hurt someone I try to make it right. If what comes around goes around then I must be living a delusion because I am getting back karma like I had killed someone. I truly am afraid to pray to God about the court and justice because I know in my heart that I cannot take it if he is let off, and now that I know God seems to do the opposite of what I ask for I cannot risk that. I also felt like me asking him not to take her before she was ready may have been an answer of She isn't ready but I can't answer Kim's prayer the way she ask them so take her daughter. I also know that if he got off God would not be there to help me through that pain. I am pretty much at a point that God will have to tell me himself that he is real. I have lost family over this quicker then over Kaylin. It isn't acceptable to them that I feel this way. I think they believe I am just having a tantrum over one thing. I may be immature but even I am not THAT immature. :) I know that people will say I don't have enough faith or didn't pray hard enough or didn't like the answer I got and that truly is not the reason I came to my decision. I know where I put my faith and as far as I am concerned it ended up misplaced. I do believe that I will see Kaylin again and I do believe that she is safe, I just don't necessarily believe it is the heaven I was raised to believe existed.

Dear Bette and Kim
I am so sorry for what you are both going through.I will not speak at this time,for I feel enough was said already, however I did listen and sometimes that's all we need someone to do.Love you's both

Hi Moms,
I still need you all so much. It will be 5 years this June since my son was killed. I am still working and maintaining my household and now am enrolled in school to complete my bachelors degree. I am taking a Logic and Reasoning class and here are some excerpts in argument that there is a God.
http://www.doesgodexist.org/Phamplets/ProblemOfHumanSuffering.html

But on the other hand I opened this discussion by reading to you a passage from the 9th chapter of John, which describes a situation that does not fall in this category. Jesus was passing by, the Bible tells us in John 9:1-3, and he saw a man who was blind from his birth, born without sight. Now his disciples asked him the typical question. They said, "Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?" It was their conviction that the problems that the man had were a result of man's sin, which in some cases is correct. But notice what Jesus said in the third verse: "Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him." Jesus said it was not because this man sinned or not even because his parents sinned that he was born blind. It was not sin that did it. It was not that this man abused his body; it was not that this man abused his environment; it was not that this man failed to heed the warnings of his environment. Jesus said it was that the works of God should be made manifest in him. Before we conclude I want to explain to you what I think that means.

In fact, is it not a marvelous thing that when those we love are no longer able to exist realistically in a physical way that they do not have to go on suffering. God has provided a means by which the spirit can be separated from the body and the physical pain that we endure now fades into insignificance. It is interesting to me that the apostles rarely used the term death to describe the end of life. They talked about being "asleep in Jesus," about being "absent from the body," about being "at home with God," and so forth. I have known people who when they lost a husband or a wife, a mother or a father, a child, a brother or a sister, have somehow seemed to quit living themselves. They atrophy and are no longer able to be happy, useful, and productive. This is a great tragedy. I pointed out in one of my other lectures that as a Christian we ought to be able to look at life much more positively because of death. As an atheist, as a disbeliever, as one alienated from God, a person has to look at life with all of its problems, with all of its suffering, with all of the pain, with all of the terrible things that one has to endure as the absolute best that he is ever going to experience. And yet, if we are wearing Christ, if we are a part of Jesus, we can look at life with all of its joy, with all of its beauty, with all of the wonderful things that we all enjoy as the absolute worst that we are ever going to have to endure. Can't we see that the difference is as different as left and right, as black and white, as night and day? If there was no other reason for us to believe in God but this one, it would be a compelling reason. Ignorance is one of the great curses of man. Ignorance of death is one of the great curses of the Christian.
Please go to the url I attached to read the entire posting.
I am so sorry I have been so wrapped up in surviving, but know that you all are on my mind and I love you all.

Also a side note:
To Jews, there is no "Old Testament." The books that Christians call the New Testament are not part of Jewish scripture. The so-called Old Testament is known to us as Written Torah or the Tanakh.
I mention that so we all understand we are very similar in beliefs, also we were drawn here like moth to the flame,and I do believe 'Something' is uniting us in our grief.
Luv 2 u all
Kay

Barb, you know I love you. :) I don't mind you talking about it at all. It is just where I am now. I really do hope that God will come through, because I would love to believe in something. So just wanted to tell you I love you and this was a lively discussion. :) I know you are doing exactly what I would be trying to do if I hadn't gotten to this point. I am inspired by your faith.

Dear Kay
I'm not sure if what you posted using the url was your professor, who had a lecture and you were a part of his class or what but I found it very interesting.I would like to thank you for posting it and also congratulate you on going back for your bachelor's degree.
Also thanks for the tip about the Old Testament( as the Christians call it) really being called the Written Torah in the Jewish faith.Do you know if the material in it is the same or different? Just so I don't make that mistake again.
I hope you come back on forum again soon,it sounds like you have a busy schedule but it was great to hear from you.Love Always and God Bless

Yes Kim ,I feel the love girl.That is what I've been trying to tell you all DUH!It is all of YOU who inspire ME.This was a lively posting wan't it? We all will find our way eventually and hopefully be content with what that is.We all have to struggle everyday with our losses.Sometimes I see life as a big domino effect.Hopefully I won't keep getting knocked down and be able to sit back and watch perfect uniformity one day.I won't hold my breath but that's what I'd like to strive for.Stop showing off with the little smile faces,I still get confused on how to do them.Oh Laura we need another lesson or was that Kim who was showing off? LOL Love and God Bless my friend

It's been awhile since I was last here..Nonethelsee, it hasn't/nor will get any better...I keep playing back, even after all these years, what my son must of been thinking, how he was suffering and I wasn't there as nis mohter to tell him how very much I love hime and that I have always been proud of him, no matter what!!!As far as the police behing held liable at Wal-mart when they encountered my son with Sheila and walked away from them both as she helped put my son in her car, because he couldn't walk..The Superior Court ruled in their favor, stating the police acted in good faith..That alone put a knife in my heart and when it was given to the Supreme Court with pictures and statements fron all of the wal-mart employees who had seen my son and told the police, "this man needs to be taken to a hospital" now, he's been badly beaten, poisoned, burnt..they too ,decided to drop the case... It sickens me to see how the police can be held criminally responsible but the court systems sides with them...It's all a conspriracy to protect their own..They are crooked police and crooked legal system!!!! I've been told more than once, when a TV Reporter or Newspaper here's the word police involvment..they too turn a deaf ear....Is there no one out there that has the balls, otner than myself, to go up against the system to help shed light on their cover-ups. In court I heard the police underoath state that the tape that played Sheila accusing my son of horricic things and in the end he's vomitting and fainting.(the police was listen to this tape being played that night, for some reason when it was time to put it into eveidence....( they lost it) out of 364 tapes they lost that one....BUT when an Fbi Profiler was doing a doctumenatary, he had that lost tape and played it on TV...GO Figure...You can't fight this twisted legal system...They go out of their way to cover up the wrong being done to another human being and themselves....No conscience!!! I hope they are haunted for life!!!

Carolynn
I saw the program watched it a couple of times, I couldn't believe the police didn't do something at the Wal Mart store it didn't take a brain surgeon to see your son was in trouble and needed help. I am so very sorry for your loss. You are right about our injustice system,,,,,
Hugs Jimmy's Mom

Thank-you, Jim's mom,

The police were so, not doing their jobs, when it came to my son and the she devil...I've been told from a very good source, that the police were afraid of her and the damage she could do when provoked...They knew first hand how evil she was ,when they were called to her home by the she devil herself, they wouldn't go there, (to her house) unless there were 2 police officers present...I've learned over the years, " I csn't fight city hall" but I'll go to my grave fighting for my son....he deserves that...The lawyers that were involved in my son's case were useless..It seens like everyone, especially in the beginning, promises the world and in the end, only gave me more heartache to go along with the heartache and emptiness I was already feeling...
We live in a sad, sad world, where justice, doesn't prevail...Only to the rich and famous..One rule for the rich and an all together different rule for the rest of us....HOW SAD...
Please let me know, how you're doing ???

Hi Carolynn
I have seen so many moms here going through crap with the justice system it breaks my heart for them. Everyone involved in my son's case (with exception of the chief of police in our town) worked very hard to make sure justice was served for my Jimmy. The little freak that murdered my son was sentenced to 40 to life + 8 years, but his mother who was involved was never charged with a thing and that just wasn't right. No matter what the outcome True Justice will never be served for us because our kids are still gone forever. I think about my son every minute of every day wondering what he would be doing now, what he would look like now. Sometimes the flash backs that make me cry, yesterday a memory hit me that actually made me smile, my son wasn't afraid of much of anything but his girlfriend's driving almost every time they went any place and she drove he would come tell me how bad she scared him. And this was a guy who would do 120 mile per hour wheelies on his motorcycle.
I am glad to see you here again I have thought about you often and wondered how you are doing. When I saw the program about Your Kenny I just couldn't believe anyone could do to him what was done, he seemed to be such a gentle guy. I think if the she devil hadn't been arrested for Kenny's murder she would still be there murdering young men. There are some very sick people out there I just wish they hadn't crossed our children's paths.
Hugs
Jim's Mom
Shirley

Hi Shirley,
I was wicked hesitant on coming back ,because when I first went onto this sight, I had no idea it would be posted for everyone to see...I always thought it was a sight for parents who lost a child...I was bull****!!! When I wrote, they were a my inner thoughts to another mother, who lost a child that might be thinking along the lines that I was thinking and more important, they could help me in my time of need..Truly, I did feel betrayed, for I was told that it was sight for grieving parents..I never once imagined, anyone and their brother could read it!!! So I left!!! However, I have no-one to turn too/write, and in the end, I would have to say, " this is the best place"..I have and never will have anything to hide..and if for any reason someone were to read what I wrote and got offended, " Oh Well" that's life!! I too, think of Kenny, every second, minute, hour of everyday..He is always close as hand!!!! I understand what you mean when you say, " You stop and try to think after all these years, what he would look like" I too, BUT, Kenny will stay the same in my mind, what he looked like before his murder...Handsome, Kind, Gentle young man, that wouldn't hurt a fly ..with his big, beautiful smile that always lit up my heart... The mans - mother , who murdered your son, since she was part of Jimmys murder, should of been sent to prison...But her prison now, is never having her son at home with her..Still, as a mother of a lost son, never good enough..I believe in eye for an eye!!!! If I believed in vodoo dolls, I would have them all lined up with their names on them and torture each and everyone of them on a daily/hourly basis..lol A mother is a protective mother, even when her son/daughter is murdered...I've become more protective now, than I was then!!!
The picture of your son you have posted, "he's handsome"!!!! " They say what goes around,& praying...I would get absoulute pleasure hearing those involved- who chose not to help my son, have come apart at the seams!!! :-) :-) That how my life has been!!!! Horrific!!!!

Smiles and Hugs to you,
Carolynn

Carolynn
I feel the same way about Jim for me he will always be 32, he had a great smile too and a laugh that would infect everyone around him. Thanks I think Jim is pretty handsome too,, takes after his MOM LOL.
I like the idea of voodoo dolls if it would really work I would have a few myself. can you just imagine the fun we could have LOL. I was told the mother would get no more than about 18 months in prison guess it wasn't worth the effort for our county to prosecute her. But you are right she is in her own prison and she created it.
I wonder if the police officers look back and think they should have done something or if they truly feel they were right with the decision they made. With the outcome I don't see how they could. Evidently the courts did you know what they say justice is blind. Seems it was blind to this for sure!
HUGS
Jim's Mom
Shirley

Hi Shirley,

Hmmmm. I don't think the courts were blind> I think they just didn't want to go against the police dept. because there are lies and hidden secrets, amongst those idiots... As I mentioned, they knew how evil the she devil was ,but were wicked scared of her!!!! As for having any guilt in the after thought and the horrific outcome..No...in their own little minds they've convince themselves, they were just!!! I know if I worked for that police Dept..I would of gone after Kenny and his safety. first...No-one, not even the Chief would help him...The Chief knew how wrong those 2 were, but if he did anything, he would of been opening Pandura's Box!!!! I pray each and everyday, none of them, every has a moment of rest ...EVER...I want them to be haunted by the pictures they saw of Kenny, and his murder and how he was murdered...They all, but one ,have children, how would they feel if a police dept. didn't act and this happen to theirs!!!

TTYS..Carolynn...:-)

Guess I should have said the justice system turned a blind eye to the police dept. so as not to see the wrong in their decision to not help Kenny. It is just so sad breaks my heart for you.
The POS that murdered my son was at a pizza parlor about 1/2 block from my house he and his mother had been there for hours drinking, he was trying to get guys to go to Jim's house with him, he even showed the gun to one guy, I think if someone had called the police just maybe my son would still be here. The guy he showed the gun to did go by Jimmy's but he wasn't home. My son was Christmas shopping for me and his little girl, his car was parked at my house. I believe with all my heart that when he left my house drove past the pizza parlor the POS and his mother followed My Jim to his house. Couldn't prove that so couldn't say his murder was premeditated he was charged with 1st degree murder was convicted of 2nd degree. Guess it didn't matter because the Judge added a life tail to the sentence and that means he will spend the rest of his life in prison. But as you know it's never enough.
Hugs
Jim's mom

Hey Shirley,

OMG...I didn't know he had a little girl..how sad is that!!! Why did the low life, kill your son? Did they have words, disagreement or was it for the thrill, just to kill and let's see who's it's going to be that I do it too?!
Ohhh...Christmas Season..it must be so hard for you, now, to enjoy that time of year...What comes over people when they drink too much...All of a sudden,they either become that evil inner person that isn't there ,when not drinking, or the other spectrum...Lovable... Drink and drugs, equals the death of a person, whether they know them or not.... How many times to you hear/read about it, that a person was so strung out on drugs/drink that they ended up killing a friend/someone they didn't know...
I know for myself that the holiday season are so very hard to do, but do them, I must..For you, they must be unbearable!!!! I'm so,so sorry for you and his little girl..How old is she now and does she understand and know what happened to her father??? As parents of murdered son/daughter, we continously play back all the took place in our heads and think, "well if this/that didn't happen he/she would be here right now to enjoy their lives...a life that shouldn't of been cut short"...They didn't deserve it..as parents, we don't deserve it!!!! I know for myself.I'm living in hell without my son, when I don't think it could get any worse, it does!!! Do you get to see your grand-daughter???? When i read your reply, I can feel your aching feeling and the sadness you have...That will never diminish, I guess. ..it's a aching,void, emptiness we'll always have...TTYS..Love, Carolynn

Yes, My Miss Sandra she is now 10 I have court orderded visitation one weekend a month. As long as her mother's family keeps their nose out of it Sandra's mom and I get along pretty good. Sandra told me last weekend she sure wished she could have known her dad longer because she doesn't really remember him. That broke my heart.
The thing started with my son and his killer at a bar three nights before, again he and his mother were drunk my son was in the parking lot the girl he had been seeing started an argument with him, the mother of the POS saw the argument going on ran up behind My Jim jumped on his back he threw her to the ground got in his car and left. When her son came out of the bar she told him the police and anyone else that would listen My Jim had beat her. Now isn't that a reason to go to some one's house kick their door then shoot them point blank in the chest. As my son turned ran to his room the POS put five more rounds through the bedroom door at chest level. In court he tried to say that Jim was beating his mother that is why he shot him defending his mother, then said Jim shot at him first. My son never owned a gun in his life always said he had no use for one. not saying Jim was some kind of an angel cause he wasn't but he was a good guy always sticking up for the underdog. And he loved his little girl he went through hell to get 1/2 custody he missed out on two years of her growing up because his ex kept taking off with her. Finally after all the court battles and jumping through every hoop that was thrown at him he got 1/2 custody. Then one year later was murdered. Christmas doesn't do a thing for me anymore I use to love it now I dread the Month of Dec. Holidays are just so hard for us all missin our angels.
Hugs
Jim's mom

Hi Carolyn, I'm not sure if you remember me but we talked on the phone. I am sorry you are having a hard time. I definitely know how you feel. On April 5th Keara will have been gone for 6 years. Sometimes I just can't believe it still. We are so wounded I think. Our children are part of us and now they are gone. I don't know if the pain will ever go away. It's hard to have such evil in our lives. I am so glad that we have this place to go to and talk to other Moms who understand.

To Keara's mom,
Yes, I do indeed remember you and talking to you on the phone....Kenny and your daughter have been gone the same amount of time, 6 yrs...Kenny's last day was March 21st...So true, it never get's any easier....Loosing a child to murder, is for me anyway, spending the rest of my living yrs, in hell!!! I've destroyed the happy years as a wife, for my husband..and a mother to my son, Bryan...I would rate myself, a 100% in doing what a mother's expectations are, but a 20% in being a happy mother, who concentrates, only on him....My heart breaks to think that they are stuck with me...The wife and mother they once knew ,is gone forever!!!!

Shirley, I'm glad to hear that you have the opportunity to see your grand-daughter..I can understand how heartbreaking it must be for you to hear her say, " she doesn't remember her father, since, you can never forget"!!! And as time goes by, they'll most likely be someone else that will take part of her life, if not, already!!! You'll always read about a murder that was brewing for a day, weeks, months by the person who committed the crime!!! " it's always, " OH and by the way" as they feed a fictitious story to the police, judge, paper, etc....For in their mind, " It's real and that's the way it happened"!!!So, it gives them the right to kill...How Sad!!! That's how my son's killer thought..she dreamt up, in her mind., something that took place and in reality, never happened....

I believe that the murder of our children has changed who we are forever. I know I'm not the same person I was and I know that most of the world cannot possibly understand what our lives are like. I couldn't be the mother my other children needed and that was very hard on them and me too. It's not that you don't love them but we are so broken and have been sapped of so much energy. I just wish this would go away but it doesn't. I guess we just learn to live with this but it is not a happy life. I hope someday I will be happier than I am now. I hope we all will be but at least we have each other.

Keara was also the mother of two children, my grandchildren. They live with their father, Keara's ex husband. He has been very good about letting me see them. My grandaughter Victoria looks so much like her Mom that it sometimes takes my breath away. It is so sad they don't have their Mom in their lives anymore. I try to see them as often as I can but now they rather spend time with their friends than Grandma. Love ya, Darien

Carolynn
I hope things turn out right for you, you and Kenny deserve the justice you are seeking I keep you and your family in my thoughts and heart.
Jim's Mom

Shirley,
Unfortunately, things couldn't have gotten any worse...well, they could, but I'm just trying to keep my head above ground...I'm not sure TRUE justice will ever be served in regards to my son, Kenny...It's an uphill battle that I'm ready to fight...I've been fighting 6 yrs..what's a lifetime?! It's for a wonderful, loving, heartfelt cause: KENNY...
How are you doing these days?
It's been one hell of a struggle for me, that seems to only get worse!!! Luv, Carolynn

Hi Carolynn
I am sure Kenny is so proud of you, We will never have true justice the only true justice would be if we had our kids back and we know that isn't going to happen. I tried to find out why the MOM wasn't charged but all I got was nothing.
This might sound crazy but I am sure the moms could understand, I have My Jim's car the tires were starting to get worn so I finally decided I needed to get new ones it made me so depressed to have to remove the tires he had on it. Then I didn't get the same type of tire and kicked myself all weekend. He had a low profile tire the ones I bought are not the same and I felt so bad. I like the new ones the car rides nicer and I know he wouldn't care. I don't know I just had a bad weekend. Am I crazy or what??
Hugs
Jim's Mom

Hi Shirley,
True Justice never will prevail for my son. Kenny...
No. you're not crazy in your thought and decisions regarding the tires for the car and how it's not completely the same ones that your son, Jimmy had on his car...As the years go by, things change ,even though we would like them to remain the same...( it can't/they won't) As a mum, I can relate to how you're feeling and cry ,if you have too...There's always that lump in our throats, that never goes away and always seems to choke us when we least expect it...Shirley, you know and I know ,it will NEVER get any esier for us...They were our sons...who we love and cherish with all our hearts and now they're gone...There is no text book on how to ease the pain when a child has been murdered...It's something that will never be answered, no-matter where we look. who we speak too or what documentary we watch on bereavement..Everyone, is different..what helps get me through the day, may not help you and vise vers..I know as a mother of a mudered son, I look for answers as to why this has happened to Kenny and myself....Is there a reason why God called him...Did I do something wrong to anger the Gods...At the end of all my questioning and thinking...There are no answers as to" Why"...We all grieve differently. but the one thing that we have have in common..We are the mothers of murder son/daughters who did not deserve to die..especially in the manner that they died in... A son/daughter is suppose to bury their parents..not the parents, burying their son/daughter.. "Life isn't fair..nor is it easy....but we persevere"!!!" we learned to get up, then we learned to put one foot and front of the other, we learned how to consume our days without really thinking...but the one thing we never learned ,is how to have a peaceful sleep" TTYS..love, Carolynn